| Results out !-- International Maths and Science ranking, from TIMS Study |  |  |  |
| Posted by admin | |
| Friday, 12 December 2008 05:55 | |
| Folks, Instead of a regular column piece, I'd like to share a piece of information below. Let us suggest ways to improve our teaching condition in schools. I have written quite a bit on this topic in my blog.http://azlyrahman-illuminations.blogspot.com/ Azly Rahman Students In Asia Score Highest On Math, Science Tests, U.S. Makes Gains In Math. The New York Times (12/10, Dillon) reports, "American fourth and eighth grade students made solid achievement gains in math in recent years and in two states showed spectacular progress," but "science performance was flat," according to a survey released Tuesday by the Trends in International Mathematics and Science Study, or TIMSS. "Fourth grade students in Hong Kong and eighth grade students in Taiwan" earned the top scores in math, "while Singapore dominated in science at both grade levels." According to the Times, "the latest TIMSS study, the world's largest review of math and science achievement, involved testing a representative sample of students in each country in 2007, the first time the tests had been administered since 2003. ... The results included fourth grade scores from 36 countries, and eighth grade scores from 48 countries." Similarly, the Washington Post (12/10, Glod) reports, "Results of the Trends in International Mathematics and Science Study (TIMSS), released today, show how fourth- and eighth-graders in the United States measure up to peers in dozens of countries. U.S. students showed gains in math at both grades." Specifically, "the average score among fourth-graders has jumped 11 points since 1995, to 529." Still, "students in Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan, Japan, Russia, and England were among those posting a higher average. Hong Kong topped the list with an average score of 607." Meanwhile, the "average science performance" for students in the U.S., "although still stronger than in many countries, has stagnated since 1995." In science, "USA fourth-graders scored 549, well above the international average of 500, but below a few Asian nations -- Singapore, Taipei, Hong Kong and Japan," adds USA Today (12/10, Toppo). "Eighth-graders scored 520, similarly above average but below a handful of other nations." According to the Associated Press (12/10, Quaid), "Kids in Massachusetts and Minnesota did even better than the U.S. overall. In fact, Massachusetts students did as well as some of their Asian peers." The Boston Globe (12/9, Vaznis) explained that Massachusetts "performed strongest on the fourth-grade science exam, coming in second worldwide just behind Singapore and ahead of Taiwan, Hong Kong, and Japan. By contrast, the United States as a whole placed eleventh with a score that researchers characterized as significantly lower than Massachusetts." In math, the state's eighth-grade "score rose 34 points to 547 from eight years ago, compared to a seven-point increase for the United States, which averaged 508 last year. In eighth-grade science, the state's score rose 23 points to 556, compared to a 5-point gain for the United States, which scored 520 last year." The Christian Science Monitor (12/10, Paulson, Khadaroo) points out that most of the math and science gains in the U.S. "took place among the lowest-performing students, a similar trend to that seen in national report cards on education." Some analysts say that could be a result "of the increased focus on bringing up America's struggling students without as much attention to those at the top." The Wall Street Journal (12/10, Hechinger) the Chicago Tribune (12/10, Malone), and the Journal of New England Technology (12/9, Lynch) also covered the story. Canada's CBC News (12/10) reports on Canadian students' performances in math and science, the BBC News (12/10) reported on U.K. students' performance, and the Jerusalem Post (12/10, Selig) covered Israel's declining math and science rankings, as reported in TIMSS. SOUCE: The Opening Bell, NJEA Publication More below, from USA Today: U.S. students' math, science scores deliver mixed results Updated FOURTH-GRADE MATH SCORES TIMSS scale average: 500 Average scores significantly higher than U.S. Hong Kong - 607 Singapore - 599 Chinese Taipei - 576 Japan - 568 Kazakhstan - 549 Russian Federation - 544 England - 541 Latvia - 537 Average not measurably different from U.S. Netherlands - 535 Lithuania - 530 United States - 529 Germany - 525 Denmark - 523 Average significantly lower than U.S. average score Australia - 516 Hungary - 510 Italy - 507 Austria - 505 Sweden - 503 Slovenia - 502 Armenia - 500 Slovak Republic - 496 Scotland - 494 New Zealand - 492 Czech Republic - 486 Norway - 473 Ukraine - 469 Georgia - 438 Iran - 402 Algeria - 378 Colombia - 355 Morocco - 341 El Salvador - 330 Tunisia - 327 Kuwait - 316 Qatar - 296 Yemen - 224 Source: Trends in International Mathematics and Science Study (TIMSS) var storyURL = http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/mathscience/2008-12-09-math-sci-scores_N.htm; By Greg Toppo, USA TODAY If there were a math-and-science Olympics for elementary and middle schoolers, USA students could hold their heads high — they're consistently better than average. In math, it turns out, they're improving substantially, even as a few powerhouse nations see their scores drop. But at the end of the day, the USA never quite makes it to the medal podium, a dilemma that has educators and policymakers divided, with some saying factors outside school play a key role in both achievement and productivity in general. For the first time since 2003, the results of the Trends in International Mathematics and Science Study, or TIMSS, a battery of international math and science tests among dozens of nations, are out — and they paint a somewhat mixed picture of achievement: On the one hand, the USA ranks consistently above international averages in both subjects. On the other hand, several nations consistently outscore our fourth- and eighth-graders, with a few countries turning in eye-popping performances. And while our students' math scores have risen, science scores have virtually stagnated since the mid-1990s — even as educators and policymakers have pushed for greater investments in science and engineering. "It's discouraging," says Francis Eberle, executive director of the National Science Teachers Association. He says educators have known about the flat scores for years and there's been no progress. "Other countries are investing and we can see their progress," he says. "Do we want to be average?" The new scores, from 2007, looked at performance for 36 countries in fourth grade and 48 countries at eighth grade. A few results: •In math, USA fourth-graders scored 529, above the international average of 500 and on par with Germany, Denmark and the Netherlands, among others — but below Hong Kong, Singapore, Japan, Russia and England. •The fourth-grade math score is up 11 points from 2003, a statistically significant difference and the first time the scores have changed since 1995. •A handful of other nations — among them England, Hong Kong, Slovenia and Latvia — have seen much bigger improvements in math, with score jumps as high as 57 points since 1995. The USA's 11-point jump is on par with that of Singapore and Iran, but much better than several nations that saw their scores drop — in the Czech Republic, for instance, fourth-grade math scores fell 54 points. •USA eighth-graders also scored above average in math, comparable to students in Hungary, England, Russia and the Czech Republic, among others, but below several Asian nations. Their scores are up 16 points from 1995. U.S. Rep. George Miller, D-Calif., who chairs the House Education Committee, welcomes the "significant gains" in math, but says it's "troubling that our students are still behind their international peers in both math and science — fields that are key to our nation's economic vitality and competitiveness. It's increasingly clear that building a world-class education system that provides students with a strong foundation in math and science must be part of any meaningful long-term economic recovery strategy." In science, the story is similar, if a bit less improved: •USA fourth-graders scored 549, well above the international average of 500, but below a few Asian nations — Singapore, Taipei, Hong Kong and Japan. Eighth-graders scored 520, similarly above average but below a handful of other nations. •USA science scores, unlike math scores, have remained flat for 12 years, while a few other nations have seen 50- to 60-point gains. Others, though, have seen their scores plummet since 1995. Brookings Institution researcher Tom Loveless says the new scores belie complaints that USA students are lagging behind the rest of the world in math. "It's just not true," he says. "It hasn't been true for a long time." The congressionally appointed National Math Panel recently called for sweeping changes in how schools teach math, pushing for a greater emphasis on algebra and higher-order problem solving. Loveless, a member of the panel, says the changes would go a long way toward improving our international ranking. "We're making progress, but we're several decades from being first in the world," he says. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [OUR USUAL REMINDER, FOLKS: While the opinion in the article is mine, the comments are yours; present them rationally and ethically. AND -- FREE ALL I.S.A. DETAINEES] ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Will post part 2 of my article on educational reform soon.
Comments (69)  ... written by Fazur, December 12, 2008 07:21:11 Who need math in Malaysia. All you need to know is the numbers. And see if your number come up in Magnum or Toto. he he he report abuse disagree 3 agree 40 ... written by Stormquest, December 12, 2008 07:57:48 UMNOputra mathematician, Prof.Dr.Ir. Datuk, Tan Sri, Tun, Sir Najib Bodohwi JKR, JPA, IDI, OT, ETC, finally announced the brilliant formula they have been using to calculate the NEP over the last few decades, One for you - I One for UMNOputras - I Two for you - II Two for UMNOputras - I II Three for you - III Three for UMNOputras - I II III Four for you - IIII Four for UMNOputras - I II III IIII Five for you - IIIII Five for UMNOputras - I II III IIII IIIII report abuse disagree 0 agree 80 ... written by ylcc, December 12, 2008 07:59:41 Dr. Azly, I too tried looking for Malaysia. I even turned the list upside down. What a disappointment!!  report abuse disagree 0 agree 21 ... written by adan, December 12, 2008 08:01:49 Teaching in general,not just mathematics and science,but all subjects require teachers competent with the content and proficient in the language. What we have are MISFITS who outnumber the dedicated ones.. thanks largely to the selection process. To supervise these misfits we have a bunch of LITTLE NAPOLEANS ... headmassters,principals, education officers at state and district levels .... who come from the same pool of misfits. They sit in postions of power waiting for promotion after every five years. They believe in SHOWMANSHIP AND GET ALL THEIR PRIORITIES WRONG... THe teachers are directed to CARRY OUT all and sundry duties EXCEPT TEACHING. THese misfits who do not understand their job descriptton CANNOT SURVIVE even single day in private educational institution. report abuse disagree 2 agree 30 ... written by ylcc, December 12, 2008 08:05:32 Hong Kong, Singapore, and Chinese Taipei are the top 3 on the list. These countries share something in common - Mandarin/English. Maybe UMNO should think twice before they suggest doing away with the Chinese schools and making BM the medium of instruction? report abuse disagree 3 agree 44 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 08:18:38 Good in Science and Maths doesn't mean anything. It could all be book learning or learning by rote. The real benefits come after - with tangible research results. I don't see Singapore, Hong Kong or even Taiwan coming out with world class research. In fact I see students in Singapore ending up as PAP stooges when they graduate heeheehee. report abuse disagree 65 agree 11 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 08:20:55 Chinese schools are also famous for rote learning. Could this be an alternative explanation for the results of the survey? report abuse disagree 27 agree 11 ... written by Old Man, December 12, 2008 08:25:21 What can we expect when the recruitment of teachers is not based on meritocracy? A so-called English teacher cannot even differentiate ABANDON and ABUNDANT! When Education Minister Hishamuddin starts carrying his crook dagger for meetings and/or assemblies, there were rumours that some teachers have started putting machetes / 'parangs' in their car boots to settle disputes! So our education in carrying crooked daggers and/or machetes is top in the world ranking!  report abuse disagree 0 agree 15 ... written by wannabepatriotic, December 12, 2008 08:40:36 Malaysia does not want to be anything 'international'. We just like to keep our stupid policies and hide under our smelly, rotten coconut shell...! We are a proud and arrogant bunch... report abuse disagree 0 agree 12 ... written by Malay Ultraman, December 12, 2008 08:40:59 Well, how could the study left out India? India produces thousands of engineers and scientists working for NASA, Medical and IT. i am not a big fan of India, but they already sent out un-manned rocket. While Malaysia can only send out at a visitor. report abuse disagree 0 agree 30 ... written by ahmadneil, December 12, 2008 08:44:54 Damn it,where is Hishamuddin!Ask him where the shit is malaysia.All this while he have been saying we all are the best in the world and yet I have to use my magnifying glass to search for where Malaysia is.He must resign to take full responsibility for shame.We have the 'best' student in the world and now where is their grade.He change Bahasa to English back and forth for math and science and now you see what is the consequence.Bloody hell! report abuse disagree 1 agree 28 ... written by CitizenBodohland, December 12, 2008 09:06:00 Sebutan nombor dalam bahasa masing-masing menyebabkan perbezaan: Sebutan utk 9: Mandarin - Chiu - 1 sebutan Kantonis - Kau - 1 sebutan English - Nine - 1 sebutan BM - Sem Bi Lan - 3 sebutan Sebutan untuk 19 Mandarin - Sher Chiu - 2 sebutan Kantonis - Sap Kau - 2 sebutan English - Nine teen - 2 sebutan BM - Sem Bi Lan Be las - 5 sebutan Renung-renungkan..... report abuse disagree 10 agree 29 ... written by kedahan63, December 12, 2008 09:07:46 Was the tests conducted in English or BM? M'sia would be on the list if they were in BM as "requested" by Amno. The probable cause of decline in our children's education esp Maths & Science is 1)the command of English by the teachers' 'educators' while they (the teachers) were in school & college 2)the fallout of the education policy change in the early years of Mahathir's regime with Anwar as his 'Education' Minister. I remember my teachers having trouble discussing Science in Bahasa Malaysia, he had to use colloqial BM.  report abuse disagree 1 agree 7 ... written by ylcc, December 12, 2008 09:35:44 written by batsman, December 12, 2008 08:18:38 "Good in Science and Maths doesn't mean anything" Dear batsman, I am really disappointed with your ignorance. The students taking medicine, bio-medicine, bio-technology, bio-chemistry (life sciences), engineering, architecture, .... Are they from the Math & Science stream or the Arts students? Have you ever tried applying for a job in the civil service in Singapore? With your kind of mentality, I am not sure that they would even bother to entertain your application (except to be polite!). Every Singaporean is aware that the government sector is the toughest sector to get into. The govt gives first preference to scholars in the civil service, and they pay them higher than the private sectors. Majority of the "stooges" in the PAP government graduate as scholars from top universities (Harvard, Cambridge, Princeton, MIT, Stanford, Yale). They are what Singapore is today. Please do not tell me that your "man in the moon" is all you can offer for Malaysia! report abuse disagree 0 agree 45 ... written by CPY, December 12, 2008 09:58:19 Ai, what to do? UMNO don't want us to be smart. Otherwise they cannot fool us! report abuse disagree 0 agree 28 ... written by pixieface, December 12, 2008 11:12:14 Hey batsman, is your head still under the tempurung. Maths and science is not important. Maybe to you. I bet you fail miserably in both subjects. Life itself is a living science. Comprando!!! There were maths and science whiz kids born in malaysia but they have left the country under umnoputra govt years ago. Why!!! BECOS THEY HAVE NO FUTURE IN THIS COUNTRY UNDER THE PRESENT REGIME. report abuse disagree 0 agree 32 ... written by cheekhiaw, December 12, 2008 11:13:53 Clearly the Malaysian education minister was busy stealing instead of waving his crooked knife around to demand special rights for his students to be given top placing... xxx report abuse disagree 0 agree 9 ... written by harryo, December 12, 2008 11:14:33 Why worry about maths? Can count money coming from front and back enough mah! report abuse disagree 0 agree 5 ... written by cheekhiaw, December 12, 2008 11:15:20 Bats do not require logic, only sound to bat around... xxx report abuse disagree 0 agree 5 ... written by sydput, December 12, 2008 11:17:12 A country that builds nuclear power plants and jet aeroplanes - Unkraine, sits lower than singapore? Hmmmm Reason for high maths scores in sinapore and hong kong- they all want to be chartererd accountants. Reason for high scores in germany/netherlands/US - engineering Reason why kazhastan is one of the top - they launch russian rockets into space. Reason why malaysia is not on the list - insignificant or too embarrasing to print results. besides the authorities/educationist cannot count not know what the figures meant. report abuse disagree 1 agree 10 ... written by AsamLaksa, December 12, 2008 11:28:32 And in UK, The Times article claims that UK's performance have improved at the price of making maths and science less enjoyable for the students... Interesting... fun vs results. I wonder who has their priorities right. report abuse disagree 0 agree 2 ... written by cheekhiaw, December 12, 2008 11:29:32 May be if the Ukrainians send their children to Malaysia to study, they would be higher? xxx report abuse disagree 0 agree 1 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 11:49:11 ylcc - what you say confirms my suspicion that students in Singapore graduate to become stooges of the PAP when they graduate. They need to be - what with all that intense competition and excellent results and all that. heeheehee pixieface - students with good results need to prostitute themselves in Singapore to get good jobs - what with the intense competition and excellent results and all that. heeheehee report abuse disagree 22 agree 2 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 11:50:52 cheekhiaw - quacking around as usual i see. report abuse disagree 5 agree 1 ... written by Lembing, December 12, 2008 11:56:22 WHAT...Malaysia not in the list...maybe it is right at the bottom and its damn malu to show it. With guys with the mentality of BATMAN in our Education Ministry who just refused to face reality and just don't have the foresight to realise the importance of English, Maths and science, Malaysia will be always be at the bottom and GOD helps us in the future with our substandard educated graduates. report abuse disagree 0 agree 8 ... written by renoir, December 12, 2008 12:00:10 Maths and science involve more than just rote learning - at a higher level they need lots of abstract, logical thought. From Dr Azly's report the three best school systems for these subjects are sinic - their common language is the Chinese script (in Hongkong the dialect might be different though the writing or script is the same). This reminds me of the theory that perhaps a pictographic language might have an advantage over a phonic one. I think, however, that it's more cultural in the sense that Chinese all over the world tend to place education above most other things. This perhaps accounts for Chinese dominance in most international science and maths Olympiads - China has won about 14 times in the 22 years of Math Olympiad history. And the American kids who came third this year were mostly ethnic Chinese, I think. Ethnic Chinese also made the bulk of American winners in the recent Chemistry Olympiad - in fact I think ALL were ethnic Chinese! Most silver medalists from Australia in the same Olympiad were ethnic Chinese too, with names such as Darren Tan, Shi Yufeng, and Elaine Mingyue (one bronze went to a non-ethnic Chinese Australian - William Jackson). An American midwestern physics professor once talked about the Chinese brain's affinity for physics, and this seems to be (but not necessarily  reflected in the International Physics Olympiad held in Vietnam this year:Gold medalists: From mainland China Tang Longzhi (absolute overall winner and winner in theory section) Lian Biao Zhou Qian He Zuoren Chen Bi From Chinese Taipei Wei Yi-shu (winner in experiment section) Ho Ying-yu Lin Yu-sheng Chu Bo-yu Lukas Peng From United States Tucker Chan Danny Chu From Indonesia Kevin Winatra Wong The rest are ethnic Chinese from Singapore, Hongkong, and Canada. Many silver and bronze medalists from several Western nations are also ethnic Chinese (Malaysian Xin Chao won a silver in the Olympiad). Now, other than ethnic-Chinese dominance in International Olympiads in Maths, Chemistry, and Physics, there's another less quantitative scientific field they're good at - biology. In this year's competition, Chinese Taipei won four golds, the US and S.Korea three, and mainland China with two golds shared third place with Singapore, Australia, and Thailand. So, again, is there something unique with Mandarin or, as I theorized, it's the culture? Or perhaps a bit of both? Whatever the case, the results appear to have less to do with educational systems than with cultural values. Note, for example, how our "inferior" educational system has produced a maths silver medalist in Loke Zhi-kin, who beat out all the top scorers from Singapore!!! In the 2000 Maths Olympiad, Malaysia performed its best ever - a bronze medal with competitors such as Shien Jin and Suhaimi Ramly. Both of them went on to the Ivy league for their tertiary studies - Shien Jin to Harvard and Suhaimi to MIT. LChuah report abuse disagree 0 agree 15 ... written by renoir, December 12, 2008 12:05:51 I wrote: >In the 2000 Maths Olympiad, Malaysia performed its best ever - a bronze medal with competitors such as Shien Jin and Suhaimi Ramly. Both of them went on to the Ivy league for their tertiary studies - Shien Jin to Harvard and Suhaimi to MIT.]] "Best ever" here means never before (the year 2000) had we won any Maths Olympiad medal. We've of course, surpassed that achievement with a silver this year. LChuah report abuse disagree 0 agree 3 ... written by chelsea, December 12, 2008 12:20:47 Hi Guys! You could google to search for TIMSS and you could find the full results in pdf of the breakdown results by countries....and yes, Malaysia did participate but overall performance is nothing to be proud of! report abuse disagree 0 agree 3 ... written by chiongguo, December 12, 2008 12:21:18 I have no reference to compare other countries on the top of the list but I do have a lot of experiences with education system in singapore and australia. Singapore's student does very well in this test partly because they had tailored the syllabus to conform to the test - at least the 8th grade syllabus which I was familiar with. Singapore was ranked way back in the 20th. placing and then they decided to change the syllabus and their ranking shot up to number 1. When I read the report with the accompanying test items I was surprised at how close the test topics was to the singapore's 8th grade syllabus. I was then a volunteer tutor to a few 8th.graders. I made a comment in soc.culture.singapore on my observation and someone I didn't know from the Min.of Ed emailed me confirming what I had said. My son who had been a product of the singapore education system and he is amongst the top in singapore in his academic achievements. He commented to me recently that while his science and maths score was very good he could not compete with his aussie's classmates in coming out with ideas, problem solving, getting things done etc. I had also taught in singapore and briefly in australia and the quality in terms of attitude is very different. But the quality in terms of been an independent agent for change, for finding out things, for coming up with new approaches, new ideas, new ways of solving things....and just new ways of trying to bluff their teacher - the aussies won hands down. These are precisely the quality that had made australia in the fore-front of a number of research and in a country that is even smaller than malaysia had 2 (stand corrected) nobel prize winner. And if patents were another measure, australia has a lot more than malaysia and singapore. I'm not talking about institutional patents from sony , motorola etc. but patents from the common folks on the ground, from SMEs etc. As batsman said the score doesn't mean much and cheekhiaw has all the characteristic of a PAP stooge  .report abuse disagree 4 agree 15 ... written by ylcc, December 12, 2008 13:05:28 Chiongguo, I agree that where ideas, approaches are concerned, Singapore may still lag behind other Western countries. Chemistry is plenty of memory work, Physics & Maths are 'logic' subjects. Biology is the toughest, which combines the English language and memory at the same time. If you think scores do not mean anything, and you are not in favour of the PAP government, why stay in Singapore? Why bother teaching in Singapore? Why let your son be educated in Singapore? report abuse disagree 3 agree 10 ... written by Sabahfan, December 12, 2008 13:26:02 Malaysias position is not even the lowest.. they are in the pigshit category... thats why they can only sent a tourist to play yo yo in space... proof of UMNO Bn policies.. useless useless and bloody useless... only to make the UMNO leaders rich and filthy rich... being rich is okay as long as it is clean rich... BUT malazut leaders are filthy rich becoause of dirty corrupted profits and bribes... report abuse disagree 0 agree 9 ... written by ylcc, December 12, 2008 13:37:06 Chiongguo, let me add something more. You do not know how lucky Singaporeans are to have the education all parents dream off at your feet. We, in Malaysia, are still struggling to find our footing! report abuse disagree 2 agree 11 ... written by EUGTAN, December 12, 2008 15:21:29 Chiongguo, Batsman If the tests prove nothing, how come the same students then go on to some of the best universities in the world. Three years ago, students in ACS Singapore (not even a top 3 school)sat for the IB for the first time in the schools history. Twenty two students in the world had a perfecy score, ACS had 9 of them. Half of those who sat coiuld gain entry into the world's best universities. Why is it that both NUS and NTU are in the top hundred univerisites, NUS being in the top 30? these two contain the bulk those who score well in the TIMS. And if the system is so 'dead', how come Singapore keep coming up with innovative solutions to its problems? Just look at how differently Singapore is dealing with the financial crisis compared to other countries. Sure there are students who are less creative and still do well. Maybe, Chiongguo's son is one of them. The Economist (no friend of Singapore but hiughly objective ) rates theb Singapore education system as one of the top 5 in the world. So TIMS results aside, the high standard is for real. Let's not denigrate the Singapore sytem either due to jealosuy or 'because it is Singapore'. As a senior manager I often have to work with Malaysian ans Singapore students. The gap is really wide. For those who have received their education in Singapore, especially those who cannot afford an expensive private education, just count yourself lucky. report abuse disagree 1 agree 12 ... written by qwerty, December 12, 2008 15:43:02 For those interested, the TIMSS 2007 report(488 pages)shows, Malaysian scored 474 for maths, the result for science is still being downloaded. What is more worrying is the continuous downward trends. Read it & weep:-  report abuse disagree 0 agree 5 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 15:51:51 EUGTAN - Going to university is also not a big deal in my view. A short story suffices.. There is these 2 children - one very bright and the other not so bright. Many years later, they met again. The bright one was surprised "How come you drive a Rolls Royce when I went to Harvard and became a professor - I can't even drive a Mercedes? When in school you always failed the Maths test - what is your secret?" The not so bright one said " No big deal - it is very easy to be successful - I buy this wonderful product for 2 sen and sell it for 5 sen. It is incredible how much money you can make with 3% profit" Seriously - Lots of people go to the best universities. Some even become professors in the best universities, but only a very rare few can excel in research. I am also disappointed with the arguments. From what I gather here, it is sufficient to speak Mandarin and have Chinese genes to be wonderful in Maths and science. Is this a chauvinists club? report abuse disagree 12 agree 6 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 16:01:50 BTW, to keep all those chauvinists in complete orgasmic mood, I'd like to feed on your egos some more. Below is a report form Hsinhua ... BEIJING, Dec. 9 (Xinhua) -- China published 78,200 Ei-indexed theses in 2007, overtaking the United States for the first time to be the world's number one, the Institute of Scientific and Technical Information of China (ISTIC) said here Tuesday. report abuse disagree 0 agree 0 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 16:09:31 Bravo! Bravo! It seems that 3000 plus years of Chinese civilisation is just to rescue the US from its financial crisis in 2009. Very smart! Excellent results in Maths and science and all that. heeheehee report abuse disagree 8 agree 1 ... written by Xerxes, December 12, 2008 17:25:41 For the information of those language chauvinists, Singapore teaches their science and maths in English. report abuse disagree 1 agree 5 ... written by Rhan, December 12, 2008 17:59:36 The chauvinist major mission is to catch up with the west. But once a while we did achieve orgasm while seeing the tuan menhafal sembilan kali sembilan sama tujuh puluh satu. report abuse disagree 0 agree 0 ... written by BukitBeruntung, December 12, 2008 18:33:07 We cannot allow this to continue! Quota must be imposed on the ranking to allows poor Malaysia to catch up. In addition, Malaysia should be categorised by separate ranking system aka Matriculation. report abuse disagree 1 agree 0 ... written by Gargamel, December 12, 2008 18:34:06 Kazakhstan - 549 Wah... Malaysia not so glorious nation hor? report abuse disagree 0 agree 4 ... written by talk2stop, December 12, 2008 18:41:59 Look at the top 4, they are all yellow and slopes. You know why they do well? Not because they are good but their parents are forcing them to do well Maths & Science. The end result, they never achieve their potential. And end up in factory trying to assemble an air conditioning unit. I rather stay in a kampong & do some fishing now and then. report abuse disagree 6 agree 1 ... written by thor, December 12, 2008 20:40:05 So Malaysia is in between Italy and Norway, holding the 21st position amongst those poll. Not something to shout abt. Not surprising our mathematical acumen has fallen so badly. Imagine when oil price increase from USD96 to USD143, our "honest,reliable and competent" AMENO and its Insignficant Others representing the government increases pump price by 78cts over original price of 192cts representing 78/192 approximately 41% increase. Causing other prices to rise in tandem. Now oil price fall to around USD45, pump price reduced by more than 5 times to 190cts representing a fall of mere 2/192cts OR 1%. Other prices which previously rises eg electricity does not fall in tandem and we hve our leaders who claim that such a reduction was at a great expense for the benefit of all MALAYSIANS. I guess we can only conclude that the above survey on our mathematical acumen especially those in AMENOs are definitely spot on. White guy go on air proudly proclaiming that if oil price does not rise above USD83, pump price will stay at 190cts, I think people like him has low KPIs that why how can the country achieved develop status by 2020. We can always lower our standards so that everybody can be "on paper" look brilliant, mind u in life what is "on paper" does not hold true. Only when they venture out into the world, will they know that nobody owes them a living but then too late, in order to survive they will then join AMENO and put spoon fed for the rest of their life but those PSEUDO will take the money and enjoy it outside of the country. If some enterprising person were to do a research on how many politicians and their immediate families from AMENO and its Insignificant Others have assets abroad I believe the result will be interesting. This cld be an exercise to improve our mathematical acumen report abuse disagree 0 agree 0 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 21:00:55 talk2stop - well said! Same parents cannot but help try to make savants out of their children. Save the Children should do something about this. This is torture of children. "Parent-made" savants often choose to become prostitutes even after they have gone to Oxford and all that. Parents be warned - "Parent-made" savants do not last beyond their teenage years. That is why they do not have any creativity to do research. Most of them become under-performing chauvinists that hang out secretively in Doc Azly's pages and crow about every bit of news that boost their miserable egos. heeheehee report abuse disagree 4 agree 0 ... written by qwerty, December 12, 2008 21:04:06 The science result:-  report abuse disagree 0 agree 1 ... written by qwerty, December 12, 2008 21:06:30 Our three years trend in science doesn't look promising:- report abuse disagree 0 agree 1 ... written by Rohani Hitam, December 12, 2008 21:14:18 We are in the top 200, better than Somalia, Uganda and Ruanda. report abuse disagree 0 agree 9 ... written by Rohani Hitam, December 12, 2008 21:17:16 If Singapore is still part of Malaysia our score is upped, hiding behind the high achievers. report abuse disagree 0 agree 6 ... written by batsman, December 12, 2008 21:24:36 Chauvinist Parents! Is it worthwhile to push your children to catch up with the west? They may burn out and become Muslims - choosing to be closer to God than to you? Why not? It is a better fate than most. heeheehee report abuse disagree 5 agree 3 ... written by Rhan, December 13, 2008 00:55:08 It is not a matter of worthiness, the capitalist world don’t give you a choice. The Chinese learned about this 200 hundred years ago but unlike the west, we don’t use cannon and battleship. It is no issue at all for us to become a Muslim as long as we look forward and learn from good Muslim like RPK who are not only get close to god, but to people like me and you as well. Don’t feel jealous. report abuse disagree 2 agree 2 ... written by renoir, December 13, 2008 03:12:58 It's rare that so many people can be both right and wrong at the same time, but not surprising because everyone seems to turn all issues into binaries. No, the idea that rote learning would allow students to win the maths and science Olympiads is erroneous. The most obvious example to the contrary is the Physics Olympiad where one must do well in both theory and practical in order to become the "absolute winner." Further, anyone thinking that rote learning has made the Chinese uncreative should remember that people like Nobel Prize winners Chen-Ning Yang and Lee Tsung Dao had their science basics at Tsinghua - they went over to the US to write their prize-winning thesis AND received their PhDs in about two years. And many subsequent Chinese Nobel prize winners in physics and chemistry also studied Chinese - "rote-fashion" - during their formative years. It's true that learning Chinese writing requires memorization, but this memory is aided with the logic of the script. A man looks small with arms loosely hung at his sides (siao), but big when his arms are spread (ta). In classical Chinese, a young sapling enclosed with boundaries becomes "distress" - a reminder that children need freedom in order to grow to their potential. As each stroke and character have their meanings, memorization isn't so difficult as most non-Chinese imagine. Yet learning Chinese certainly needs more memory power than learning phonetic scripts, and there're people who think that this requirement is one reason why the Chinese-educated often beat the English-educated in maths. For USEFUL creativity comes only AFTER one has mastered the basics, and this always involves some memorization. In fact, there was a big debate in the US during the 80s and early 90s over the way American kids were instructed, based on the misconception that creativity and rote memorization are incompatible. Probably with some reluctance, more and more American educators have come to accept that memorization is intrinsic to all skill-learning. That's why I talked about not seeing things in binaries or opposites. Sole dependence on memorization is certainly bad, but nothing could be learned without some memorization. Before one could be creative in kungfu or karate one must memorize, day in and day out, the basic movements of the art. In gymnastics, the most difficult and risky movements depend on basic skills that are acquired through constant repetitions and practice. In representational painting, one must first remember certain dos and don'ts - mixing vermilion with Prussian blue often results in muddy colors because of their chemical incompatibility. Painting over a spot several times in watercolor often results in dull colors, if that spot doesn't have a hole in it in the first place. Many so-called "creative" methods of teaching Art seldom survive the grade school class - paintings of the unskilled have a strange way of seeming all alike, contrary to the fanciful claims of their proponents. To be continued report abuse disagree 0 agree 5 ... written by renoir, December 13, 2008 03:15:05 Continued Chinese calligraphy is a good example for illustrating the need for repetitive learning before one could become "creative." Every famous Chinese calligrapher must first learn how to hold the brush, how much ink to use, and when to paint over a previously painted area. These are basic skills that must become part of the calligrapher before he could deviate from them. The deviations that resulted are what the public calls originality. In other words, before one could be original, one must first know very well what is not. The process is the same when writing in English - one cannot imitate the streams of consciousness of James Joyce or produce the visual play of E. E. Cummings without first grasping the basics of English grammar. One must first learn the rules, and that often requires repetition - memorization - before one could intelligently break them. So skill learning must involve some memorization, and creativity is a departure from that memorization. The two processes are interdependent - once cannot exist without the other. There's no up without a down, no north without a south. Many American educationists have recognized that the poor maths skills of American students were due to lack of such basic spadework, or "rote learning" if you want to call it that. On the other hand, others also have a point that, beyond the acquiring of basic skills or knowledge, emphasis must be made to encourage thinking outside the box. In Malaysia, Chinese schools are not wrong in offering rote-learning: where they've gone wrong is that they often do not go beyond that phase. This is due partly to our teaching tradition (not necessary Chinese - it was also the old British way), and partly to poorly trained teachers. In the West, the other end of the spectrum occurs as teachers think that by stressing on "creativity" students would do well in maths and science. That's the kind of romanticism that created a generation of poorly-skilled workers, and the reason why many Japanese auto factories have relocated to Canada because of better skilled workers in that neighboring country. Will return next Tuesday, folks. Have a great weekend! LChuah report abuse disagree 0 agree 8 ... written by batsman, December 13, 2008 07:44:58 ylcc – When you tell Chingguo to get out of Singapore, you sound exactly like a UMNO ultra screaming at Chinese to get out of Malaysia. Rabid racists matched only by stinking filthy chauvinists. PAP stooges will always match UMNO cronies. It is a match made in hell. report abuse disagree 2 agree 4 ... written by batsman, December 13, 2008 07:49:12 Rhan, heeheehee. Good to know you have nothing against Islam. I wonder if some of the chauvinists here feel the same? report abuse disagree 2 agree 0 ... written by batsman, December 13, 2008 07:56:30 Renoir - Good argument on the pros and cons of rote learning, but somehow I am not convinced. We are talking about 14 yr olds here, not rocket scientists. Still i concede that each community has the right to choose the education system that they want. No need to boast it is the best in the world. report abuse disagree 4 agree 2 ... written by batsman, December 13, 2008 07:59:41 BTW the traditional madrasah schools use a very similar method of learning to the chinese schools. Only the emphasis on subject matter is different. report abuse disagree 0 agree 2 ... written by ylcc, December 13, 2008 08:37:09 batsman, there is a misunderstanding here. I did not mean it that way. If I had got my message wrongly to Chingguo, then I apologise. Some people are just not appreciative of the kind of education that we parents in Malaysia dream off for our children at their feet. If a place we live in gives you freedom in religion, language, culture, education, and is doing a good job - why resent the government? What more do we want? If UMNO is just as fair and provide our children the same quality of living, I would not bite the hands that feed me. report abuse disagree 1 agree 5 ... written by Loh, December 13, 2008 16:05:07 ///Where is Malaysia? Did they not participate in the test or did they not rate?/// Of course NOT. Otherwise HongKong and Singapore would not be where they are! report abuse disagree 0 agree 0 ... written by batsman, December 14, 2008 14:19:32 ylcc - ya, ya, ya, sure, sure. Guesss it's back into the closet again. report abuse disagree 0 agree 0 ... written by kavidibaku, December 14, 2008 14:22:39 Reasons why Malaysia can't perform: 1) maths and science teachers are simply not qualified 2) teachers are not dedicated, committed 3) teachers do not enter class; even if they enter they do not teach 4) many schools are lack of math and science teachers 5)teachers do not finish syllabus 6) teachers teach to exam and not to understand math and science 7) our education system only emphsize examination. Even if they do project and the teachers mark, they give high scores to their students to maintain their school results which will never resemble true performance etc etc report abuse disagree 1 agree 3 ... written by renoir, December 15, 2008 17:18:03 >We are talking about 14 yr olds here, not rocket scientists.]] Batsman, I've no indication we're talking only about 14-year-olds. But certain that age group is included when we're talking about maths and science and most kinds of skill-learning. In other words, some memorization is inevitable. Of course, I'm not asking you to be convinced. >i concede that each community has the right to choose the education system that they want.]] So do I. > No need to boast it is the best in the world.]] That's absolutely true. The present system of grading, for example, is an off-shoot of a particular worldview. How than can anyone say which is the best educational system in the world??? LChuah report abuse disagree 0 agree 4 ... written by Aming, December 16, 2008 06:43:15 A factual case of 2 young graduates working at the Global forex office of Std Chart Bank based in Singapore. One from University of Malaya and another a product of Singapore and University of New South Wales. Both started off with same salaries in 2007. Came 2008, the MU grad was given a raise of S$50 per month whereas the UNSW grad's increment was a whopping S$800. The decision came from their British boss. This incident says alot of the standard of Malaysian education and its global competiness. report abuse disagree 0 agree 2 ... written by miwaki, December 21, 2008 16:14:48 Malaysia only need to understand one thing in Math,that is to double up when there are 2 people to share,triple the amount when there are 3 people to share and so on.Don't believe me,ask our ministers ! report abuse disagree 0 agree 2 ... written by A MI, December 22, 2008 07:13:04 Was the study comprehensive? I am sure there is anecdotal evidence that school children in India are very strong in Mathematics. Anyway Indians currently are dominating in the ICT arena and that must have something to do with numbers report abuse disagree 0 agree 0 ... written by Navigator, December 24, 2008 19:55:35 Who cares about these results? The bumis still get into local universities and their Varsity Union chief does not want any non-bumis in the unviersities. No competition is necessary. We live in a world of our own - our Bolehland. report abuse disagree 1 agree 1 ... written by born2reign, December 25, 2008 09:17:11 Dear Navigator, please don't be so angry that the bumis get to enter local unis. As of today, the private sectors are not employing local grads, when interviewees come in for interviews, the HR tests them again anyway 'coz we can't trust their certs. Like the Zimbabwe paper currencies, so is the Malaysian uni degrees - no value. The bumis love paper degrees so they get one thinking it is highly valued. It's like someone holding 10 Ringgit note, by the end of 12 months, it's only worth RM0.50. Just leave them be. Trying to fight the Law of Prosperity is like trying to swim uphill (good if you are a salmon). Najis will tell you our Ringgit is strong and all the blah...but why are HSBC, global banks, China, Arab Saudi purchasing and having backlog delivery of physical gold and other precious metals? Why are they busy increasing the currency supply into the economy and telling you to believe in their currencies while the central banks are hoarding physical metals? Summary: While the world believes in the value of paper currencies, govts KNOW they are valued as toilet paper. While the world believes that degrees mean jobs and success, in reality Prosperity Law demands a good attitude, willing to learn, high achiever, multi-lingual employee or partner to be selected and engaged by any company. Why? High supply, low demand. Low supply, high demand. So the UMNO govts are REALLY REALLY REALLY anti-Malays. REALLY. This is FACT!! So just relax and enjoy the wealth transfer into the minorities' hands. report abuse disagree 1 agree 5 |
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Another indictment on the bad policies on education by the ignoramus in the government and Education system?